Sampling Drums Monor or Stereo?

[Sa'id]

One of the most common questions that people ask about sampling drums is:
"Should you sample drums in mono or stereo?"

Simple enough question, but the implications are deeper. See, most drum sound questions are almost always rooted in two other commonly asked questions, "how do I make my drum sounds bang?" and "how do I make my drums sound more full?"

In order to properly answer the question of whether you should sample drums in Mono or Stereo, we must address the two aforementioned "root" questions...

So what do producers mean when they say "bang"?
Many people incorrectly attribute bang to volume; thereby opting for a quick-fix of simply raising the volume on the drum sound(s) that they want to bang. However, the result of this is always just louder (obnoxious) drum sounds. And in the worst case of the mis-diagnosis of "bang", the volume of the drum sounds, (in particular, the kick drum), is raised up so high that it dominates and drowns out all other sounds within the beat.

Still others attribute "bang" to simply a series of clever processing and mixing applications like compression, reverb, etc. But too much processing results in weak drum sounds-- sounds that on one hand, meet a hot signal requirement, but on the other hand, lack the proper attack, or an appropriate threshold level. So even with most unique processing, the emphasis is still placed on some sort of volume-shaping scheme.

But bang is really more about "complete force"; the entire complexion of a beat as it pertains to its drum sounds. The thing is drums are never meant to be taken alone as a separate piece of music. On the contrary, drums are a component of the complete arrangement of the beat. Granted drums are one of the most important, (if not thE most important elements of a Hip Hop-Rap beat), but you can not get away from the fact that drums are a component of the composition, NOT the composition itself. And as such, when producers discuss "bang", we are really discussing the "complete force" of a beat, as it is directly related to it's drum sounds and drum programming.

Now, on the real, it's not that volume and processing doesn't come into play when we discuss the "bang" of drum sounds, it's just that the understanding of how drum sounds will be programmed (arranged) is much more vital to the "bang" effect than most people realize!
The particular points where drum sounds are placed within a sequence go a long way in determining how well the overall beat is going to bang. For instance, the more kick hits that land within a sequence, and therefore within the entire beat, the less bang effect. Think about what happens if you layer a typical snare over a typical kick: the kick drowns out the snare, and each sound diminishes the other, rendering both sounds flat--no bang! Now imagine a thick bass line riding over too many kick hits. The bass will sound bumpy, and the kick will some clumbsy and muffled. Hence, drum sounds need their proper space, and the kick drum, the most important of all drum sounds, needs the most space in order for an effective "bang" to occur.

And what do producers mean when they say "full"?
When producers of great drum sounds and hard-hitting drum programs say "full", they are really describing the strength and independence of their drums. A strong drum program is always predicated upon the drum sounds from which it's built. And thus "full" represents that essential balance of rich sounds and effective program. I always say that drums should always be: Ready & Steady. What I mean by that is that a drum program should contain the proper sounds. The richness of the sound can be because of its power or its sublty; it can because of length or its texture. That's the "Ready" part. The "Steady" that I speak of deals with sole purpose of drums: timing and rhythm. Drums should never over-burden a beat. Think of it like the process of driving a car. The drums are below, they push and release the gas, they keep the beat moving at an appropriate speed, while the other sounds work the steering wheel.

So back to the original, commonly asked question:
"Should you sample drums in Mono or Stereo?"

Well, having described the significance of determining how you will be programming your drum sounds, the answer is: Mono!!!
Stereo sampling didn't even really come into play until 1997/1998, right around the time Akai introduced the MPC 2000. Prior to that, pretty much every producer sampled their drums in mono. Word up, keep this in mind: the overwhelming majority of well-known producers who built their brand name did so off of drum sounds that were sampled in mono! Reason why? Because every producer of that era was indoctrinated in the method of sampling records via a DJ mixer signal chain. That is: record on turntable, turntable to DJ mixer, DJ mixer main output (or Send) to the mono input of a sampler.

But here's what happened. The industry standard manufacture medium, (the format of the mass produced recording for commerce), switched from vinyl record to CD. Furthermore, the industry capture medium, (format of original recording), switched from analog tape to digital. And even more significant, as sampling technology increased in its sophistication, samplers increased in their capability; and thus, the question of sampling in stereo garnered greater and greater attention.

But here's the thing that you should know about records that were recorded and mixed as recent as 15 years ago: Nothing was 12 O'Clock! What I'm referring to is the fact that songs were rarely ever mixed dead center. Instead, sounds were panned hard right or hard left. Hence, when you sample drum sounds, especially from records 15 years old or older, it is far more effective to sample them in mono than in stereo. Sampling drum sounds in stereo splits the sound. That is, it breaks the sound into two even pieces so that the sound outputs evenly through both the right and left channel. And when it comes to sampling your drum sounds, you want an independent, strong signal, NOT a co-dependent signal that is weakened by a stereo split.

Sa'id

The above excerpt is from the Fifth Edition of the BeatTips Manual, due out in 2008.
Copyright © 2007 A. Said/Superchamp Inc.

[Kevin Doyle]

This is great advice showing on how the fullness of a kick is not just how loud your drums could be. You really broke down the process of having a kick bang without taking away from the snare or bassline. I'll definatly think of this more when i'm making beats.

[initialP]

Yo how do u sample in mono, do u have to record it in mono or can u switch bak and forth after uve recorded? I use a USB turntable to record in audacity and export an MP3 of the song I want then move it into acid pro to chop. Is there any way I can set up my USB to record to Acid becuz it doesnt do it. But anyway after I record in Audacity and move it to Acid is there any way to change it from mono bak to stereo bak and forth so i can use mono wen choppin drum hits and stereo for instruments? If not, how do I record my records in mono?

Hopefully you guys know what im talkin about lol thanks for the help in advance

[krazyfingaz]

Thanks alot Sa'id, you answered a question that I've been looking for a answer to for a while.

[L Eye]

if you're using just one sample for your drums, then, yeah; make it mono. however, if you're stacking drum sounds (using more than one snare.....bass drum...ect.) then go both stereo and mono. one of these samples should be your predominant sound. if it was recorded in the 70's or something, that engineer probably set up some room mics, or threw some funky ass reverb on the track. YOU WANT THAT SHIT IN STEREO! then use your other drum sounds and stack them underneath that sound in mono (or, if it works out - stereo.....whatever sounds good) and pan that mono drum sound accordingly.

record your tracks in stereo using your USB turntable into your DAW (acid,cuebase,protools,sonor,ect.) then save that file as a separate mono track. then you can bounce between the stereo and mono tracks to see what sounds better. Oh yeah, never save what you're going to sample as an mp3. that should be reserved for your mixdown to throw up on the net. always save as a .wav file in stereo and in mono.

[Cary_Clark]

Originally Posted by L Eye

if you're using just one sample for your drums, then, yeah; make it mono. however, if you're stacking drum sounds (using more than one snare.....bass drum...ect.) then go both stereo and mono. one of these samples should be your predominant sound. if it was recorded in the 70's or something, that engineer probably set up some room mics, or threw some funky ass reverb on the track. YOU WANT THAT SHIT IN STEREO!

L,

I gotta disagree with this. Sometimes you want the stereo image on the record and sometimes you don't. If you sampling a record from the 1970's and the drums are paned hard right and the drum reverb is paned hard left that is an interested image but it may hurt you later when your trying to match those drums to a piano sample that has a really long reverb time. Because both instruments have different reverb times and characteristics they will not sound as though they were recorded in the same space and this can distract listeners and create a undesired effect. I always try to have my work sound as realistic and natural as possible so that the instruments blend together. Sampling in Mono and Stereo is about the content that your sampling and I don't think that there are really any ultimatums.

[c_breeze]

great topic...

[DANEJA]

Originally Posted by Sa'id

One of the most common questions that people ask about sampling drums is:
"Should you sample drums in mono or stereo?"

Simple enough question, but the implications are deeper. See, most drum sound questions are almost always rooted in two other commonly asked questions, "how do I make my drum sounds bang?" and "how do I make my drums sound more full?"

In order to properly answer the question of whether you should sample drums in Mono or Stereo, we must address the two aforementioned "root" questions...

So what do producers mean when they say "bang"?
Many people incorrectly attribute bang to volume; thereby opting for a quick-fix of simply raising the volume on the drum sound(s) that they want to bang. However, the result of this is always just louder (obnoxious) drum sounds. And in the worst case of the mis-diagnosis of "bang", the volume of the drum sounds, (in particular, the kick drum), is raised up so high that it dominates and drowns out all other sounds within the beat.

Still others attribute "bang" to simply a series of clever processing and mixing applications like compression, reverb, etc. But too much processing results in weak drum sounds-- sounds that on one hand, meet a hot signal requirement, but on the other hand, lack the proper attack, or an appropriate threshold level. So even with most unique processing, the emphasis is still placed on some sort of volume-shaping scheme.

But bang is really more about "complete force"; the entire complexion of a beat as it pertains to its drum sounds. The thing is drums are never meant to be taken alone as a separate piece of music. On the contrary, drums are a component of the complete arrangement of the beat. Granted drums are one of the most important, (if not thE most important elements of a Hip Hop-Rap beat), but you can not get away from the fact that drums are a component of the composition, NOT the composition itself. And as such, when producers discuss "bang", we are really discussing the "complete force" of a beat, as it is directly related to it's drum sounds and drum programming.

Now, on the real, it's not that volume and processing doesn't come into play when we discuss the "bang" of drum sounds, it's just that the understanding of how drum sounds will be programmed (arranged) is much more vital to the "bang" effect than most people realize!
The particular points where drum sounds are placed within a sequence go a long way in determining how well the overall beat is going to bang. For instance, the more kick hits that land within a sequence, and therefore within the entire beat, the less bang effect. Think about what happens if you layer a typical snare over a typical kick: the kick drowns out the snare, and each sound diminishes the other, rendering both sounds flat--no bang! Now imagine a thick bass line riding over too many kick hits. The bass will sound bumpy, and the kick will some clumbsy and muffled. Hence, drum sounds need their proper space, and the kick drum, the most important of all drum sounds, needs the most space in order for an effective "bang" to occur.

And what do producers mean when they say "full"?
When producers of great drum sounds and hard-hitting drum programs say "full", they are really describing the strength and independence of their drums. A strong drum program is always predicated upon the drum sounds from which it's built. And thus "full" represents that essential balance of rich sounds and effective program. I always say that drums should always be: Ready & Steady. What I mean by that is that a drum program should contain the proper sounds. The richness of the sound can be because of its power or its sublty; it can because of length or its texture. That's the "Ready" part. The "Steady" that I speak of deals with sole purpose of drums: timing and rhythm. Drums should never over-burden a beat. Think of it like the process of driving a car. The drums are below, they push and release the gas, they keep the beat moving at an appropriate speed, while the other sounds work the steering wheel.

So back to the original, commonly asked question:
"Should you sample drums in Mono or Stereo?"

Well, having described the significance of determining how you will be programming your drum sounds, the answer is: Mono!!!
Stereo sampling didn't even really come into play until 1997/1998, right around the time Akai introduced the MPC 2000. Prior to that, pretty much every producer sampled their drums in mono. Word up, keep this in mind: the overwhelming majority of well-known producers who built their brand name did so off of drum sounds that were sampled in mono! Reason why? Because every producer of that era was indoctrinated in the method of sampling records via a DJ mixer signal chain. That is: record on turntable, turntable to DJ mixer, DJ mixer main output (or Send) to the mono input of a sampler.

But here's what happened. The industry standard manufacture medium, (the format of the mass produced recording for commerce), switched from vinyl record to CD. Furthermore, the industry capture medium, (format of original recording), switched from analog tape to digital. And even more significant, as sampling technology increased in its sophistication, samplers increased in their capability; and thus, the question of sampling in stereo garnered greater and greater attention.

But here's the thing that you should know about records that were recorded and mixed as recent as 15 years ago: Nothing was 12 O'Clock! What I'm referring to is the fact that songs were rarely ever mixed dead center. Instead, sounds were panned hard right or hard left. Hence, when you sample drum sounds, especially from records 15 years old or older, it is far more effective to sample them in mono than in stereo. Sampling drum sounds in stereo splits the sound. That is, it breaks the sound into two even pieces so that the sound outputs evenly through both the right and left channel. And when it comes to sampling your drum sounds, you want an independent, strong signal, NOT a co-dependent signal that is weakened by a stereo split.

Sa'id

The above excerpt is from the Fifth Edition of the BeatTips Manual, due out in 2008.
Copyright © 2007 A. Said/Superchamp Inc.

excellent...!

[DOMINGO]

Originally Posted by DANEJA

excellent...!

100% on point!